And a large army [of journalists] appeared there. As usual, he praised the atomic energy program and the progress that had been achieved. Because, after all, this is a dangerous technology. So the necessary measures were taken to remove that water from there. Operators are trying to cool it, however, it was, already known that one or two people had already passed away. Do you understand? But in the end, it all came down to the fact that the most effective measure was dust suppression, which in most contaminated areas meant just plain mechanical removal of the most contaminated debris. That put an end to this sort of thing. Look, the fire ended, Adamovich: It started at around four or five in the evening. That is because he has a good habit of carefully listening to the specialists, quickly gasping their point, and be immediately ready to make decisions. For example, the injection of liquid nitrogen that was done per my proposal made around the 2nd of May and implemented around the 4th or 5th of May. W, flying on an airplane from there and as soon as he arrived, we would load into, the already prepared aircraft and fly to Kiev, where we would go by car to the, The first, approved, now I say from memory, was, in addition to Comrade, SHCHERBINA, the Minister of Energy MAYORETS, the Deputy Minister of, Health VOROBYEV Evgeny Ivanovich, who also arrived from another region of, the Soviet Union in Vnukovo, slightly earlier than Shcherbin. In a shocking and humbling act of self-sacrifice, Legasov recorded everything he knew about the truth behind Chernobyl's explosion and hung himself, knowing that his sudden death would force. And I have to say that five of them had failed. For example, certain numbers are sent: 1-2-3-4. These simulators would allow continuous training of personnel to properly react when a deviation from normal operation occurs. Can the Soviet Union, for example, limit the number of devices that are there, gradually put those that have no cover out of service, and hence, switch to fossil fuel. One must understand which processes are happening with the radioactive elements, how they differ from other processes, what can be introduced and what that will lead to. The answer is NO. Based on the simplest estimates that I could make, this commission seemed redundant, because with the system of wells and dams in place, the exchange of radioactivity between the water and silt would not pose any significant danger to the Dnieper sea. This doesnt mean that the spreading of radioactivity ended. You are then given special clothing, like this one, blue or white. We drove up to the building of the Pripyat City Committee of the Party, placed ourselves in a hotel nearby, where we stayed for about ten days in Pripyat itself, but the headquarters. How can I listen to Valery Legasov tapes? Well, because many radioactive elements have accumulated inside coal and oil seams over the centuries. Then with all these measures, by dropping all kinds of materials, we began to lower it and reduced it to 300 degrees in the end. The second one. So we had to send a considerable number of helicopters to take the measurements and investigate. Valery Alekseyevich Legasov was born on September 1, 1936, in Tula, Russian SFSR, into a family of civil workers. And here the fateful mistake was made, from which, specifically, Chernobyl began. Everyone worked as a single collective, attempting to find the best solution. However, more radiation would escape through this top cover but it would be comparable to or even less than the total radiation on the site. However they also compared what many specialists say. [5] While Legasov attempted to include all the top scientists in the new organization, many objected to Legasov being given a top leadership position, considering him an upstart. For example, when there was a need to propose that the share of RBMK devices in nuclear energy be increased, then Anatoly Petrovich Aleksandrovs support was required on this issue. Normally, everything would be stored on a single personal computer, in one or two disks, located next to the operator so that he could at any moment clarify something. But as soon as the first such reactor, the first one they plugged in near Leningrad, a 100 kilometres from Leningrad, the first such RBMK reactor As soon as it began to run, right away it was discovered that the reactor was bad, that it was difficult to control, that its neutron fields started to float. about the accident at the station "Trimayalen", Show that most likely the reason that led to the accident, has nothing to do with, the events in Chernobyl because of the fundamental difference in the design of, In Kiev, when we got out of the plane, the first thing that caught our eye was the, cavalcade of black government cars and the disturbing crowd of Ukrainian, leaders headed by the Chairman of the CM of Ukraine, Comrade. In this reactor, 1,700 tons. While individual researchers had proposed various solutions for dust suppression, in the summer of 1986, one of the main challenges was preventing the spread of contaminated dust over large distances. The tragedy, of course, was the primary background against which everything was going on. This put the medics in a difficult position. This military centre was organized, and worked on selecting appropriate measuring equipment, the most appropriate conditions and routes, on developing technological methods for decontamination. Because his colleagues got bonuses from the Ministry; because the institute was part of the Ministry of Medium Machine Building. All this created such problems that it became evident that the shift method, in this case, was certainly not optimal. It would be, so to say, outside international standards, outside international regulations. So changes to the regulation are introduced for one device but not for another. The party members and the government were quite worried about all this. Of course, this was wrong. For example, not far from the station was a heavily contaminated forest (up to several roentgens per hour such radiation at the beginning it had) which was named the Red Forest. These decisions determined the entire order of organisational work for the rest of the period. I must say that at multiple times that I attended the Operative group meetings, these meetings were held in a very calm and conservative manner. As a result, one project alone, of the three successful projects that cost us 17 million roubles, began to generate an annual income of 114 million roubles.For four years now, the corresponding industry and technology have been working. I liked him from the very beginning. A large number of construction resources was spent on creating objects that were not related to the field of the department. Do you understand? Although I had not been able to describe the issue in such a way, he did. This, as far as I can remember, was the only article that had a helpful, calming effect on others. But the logic behind these actions was this. And then stared at the ceiling til the end of his shift, doing practically nothing. All the power and all the responsibility must be in the same hands. I know that it can be difficult; you need to endure, wait it out. No information was received about radiation-related injuries and this fact, while not conclusive, did calm us down somewhat. He consistently looked for possible sources of issues that would lead to accidents, systematized them, and made probabilistic evaluations of events, estimates of the likelihood of an event leading to a release of radioactivity. They lost 17 people there, the Americans. Around the same time when the fate of the 3rd block was decidedwell, because of such conditions its launch had been delayed from summer, for when it was planned, to autumnthe necessity of setting up and launching work on the 5th and 6th blocks was very keenly discussed. He is now mainly remembered for his work in containment of the Chernobyl disaster and presenting the investigation findings to the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) in Vienna. Others, who possibly knew the situation at the nuclear power plants much better, were sort of very calm about it. Legasov: First of all, you would imagine that I have some special place in this whole story because Ive been in the field of nuclear energy for 15 years. But apart from that, it was still and silent. So this was indeed true, but nevertheless Anatoly Petrovich insisted that Kokoshin must write an article refuting these views. And the very fact that the station could independently perform any actions not authorised by the experts is already a defect in the relationship of the experts with this station. He did say that about one of the reactors, the AST, a nuclear power plant of an entirely different type, which really is the safest of all that exist in the world today; about that he said that it can be put even in Red Square. If you would wish to read them, then here, we translated them for English readers: Tape 1 side A In this part Legasov speaks about his first days in the accident zone. But getting less and less overall. As for neutron sensors, they were the responsibility of CNIIP [Central Science Research and Project Institute] of the Ministry of Medium Machine Building. Such decisions were adopted, but if some experimental data appeared that showed that the conservation of Pripyat could be avoided and it could be decontamination and even inhabited later, then the Operative would change their decisions according to new data, without seeing something bad in that change. So it was impossible to load it into the helicopters, first of all. The station was 140 kilometres from Kiev. He was afraid of radiation - everyone is afraid of it. [7] Legasov was impressed by the operation of the KGB in the area but considered the Civil Defence group to be in shambles. In economy, in cost per kilowatt-hour of energy, in fuel consumption, it was about the same as VVER, better in some ways, worse in others. But within 25 - 75 biological roentgens, the decision to evacuate lied with the local authorities. So if the temperature reached 2,500 degrees, then it would not be three per cent of radioactivity that gets released but the entire 100 per cent. Then an initial assumption was made that the source of such high activity was the roof of the 3rd block on which was a lot of scattered fuel. The following piece of audio is a self-made recording in English, based on the original Russian transcripts from the recorded tapes of Valery Legasov. The scientific part of the team, who were responsible for the correctness of decisions, made these decisions without the support of Moscow, Kiev, or Leningrad. The 26th of April, 1986 was a Saturday, a beautiful day and I was thinking of either going to my university department and finishing something for them, or maybe letting things slide and going with my wife, Margarita Mikhailovna, and my friend to rest somewhere, or of going to the party activists meetin. This is what I want to tell you today. Since we did not receive any, specific information here, we quickly plunged into cars and I found myself in the, 140 km. Suggestions. Formally however I had to be replaced in Silaevs team by Eugeny Petrovich Ryazantsev - deputy of the director of our Nuclear Energy Institute. This was sort of the main task in that period. [I began] to speak about the necessity of the next generation of reactors to be safer; say TTER reactors or liquid salt reactors that I was trying to present as the next steps towards safer reactors. Legasov: The director of ChNPP was in shock, from beginning to end. Before him, Viktor Alekseyevich Sidorenko worked as the director of the department of nuclear reactors. This is not a nuclear station. This is very important. However, there were some issues. But the number of such articles could certainly have been increased. Dust transfer because of a dry summer was also enlarging the contaminated areas. You approach the gates of the Skazochniy Pioneer Camp. The first drops were, it seems, at the end of the day on the 27th. [7], Excessive hierarchy has always been contraindicated for science, it stifles it. But the iron shot that we found at the station was contaminated with radioactivity. When on an even surface but inside strong radiation fields, their electronics, usually the control modules, failed making them inoperable. And within that 30-kilometre zone, the talk was mostly about Caesium contamination, because several Caesium spots had appeared (these will be shown on the maps) and the creation of Caesium maps began in the period from the date of the accident until the 20th of May, after which the creation of such maps was stopped. Somewhere around the 10th day of May, Vyacheslav Dmitrievich Svetliy arrived, who was called by Velikhov. And then, from the position of Vladimir Mikhailovich Novikov, state that the level of device that we currently have is probably sufficient to ensure that Chernobyl does not happen again. It would enclose the object in what is called a containment (maybe an underground option or other possible engineering options), but the most important for reliability is to have a system that does not rely on a geographical site. When one looks at the chain of events, why someone acted in this way and another in that way and so on, it is impossible to point to a single culprit, an initiator of all the unpleasant events that led to the crime. In the accident, no one was killed or exposed to radiation. And we had to know whether those bubblers were empty or not. And, a little later, Egorov from the Adamov Institute but he arrived a day or two later. Vyacheslav Dmitrievich Pismienniy was made responsible for laser technology. It needed a fight to, Speaking of the conversations with Mikhail Sergeyevich Gorbachev. But how they did it, how they made it happen, I still cannot imagine because I only know the result of their work. And conclude this section about the consequences with such normal wordsthat this is a long-term program, that the consequences of this accident will manifest themselves for many, many years, and describe how they will manifest, and that the research front is a broad, so to say, rough plan. The composition included heads of the main institutions associated with the work around Chernobyl and also leading experts, such as academician Sokolov, academician Mikhalevich and academician Trefilov, who were associated with particular tasks of ecological or technical nature related to the liquidation of the consequences of the accident. Moreover, many of them either hadnt been charged, or the people had not been instructed on how to use them and when to recharge them. They rushed to their cars to evacuate themselves and, in the process, 17 people died in cars. And at 8.40 pm, approximately, the first meeting of the Government Commission was held in Pripyat itself in the city committee of the party. [THE INTERVIEW TO A.ADAMOVICH, JUDGING BY THE INSCRIPTION ON THE CASSETTES B SIDE]. Boris Yevdokimovich probably made a mistake but it is hard to say. An unexpected problem occurred with, for example, specimens lowered into the Finnish station Loviisa. In Soviet nuclear energy, precisely because of the pace that had to be quite high, because ten years had been lost, this third element, from my point of view, was criminally ignored. Valery Legasov was a Soviet chemist who investigated what caused the Chernobyl nuclear power plant disaster on April 26, 1986. And then to catch up, quickly, this option was proposed. From that moment the Government Commission became only an administrative mechanism for that huge government work that was done under the control of the Operative group of the CCCPSU. I will discuss the station itself, its history and operation a bit later so I won't disrupt the chronological order of this recording. I tried to tell Boris Yevdokimovych. And above that article, there was a lousy illustration, in which in front of a half-wrecked cooling tower, a young moustached Frenchman is trying to explain to a Russian bear how to build those cooling towers, while the bear has put a finger in his mouth and hardly understands that the quality of the cooling tower is as essential to the quality of a nuclear station as the reactor itself. We need to think about some special measures to localize accidents for those 28 devices that dont have containments. And if we took the accumulated statistics, then the statistics on the operation of RBMK reactors were minimal compared to the VVER. Apparently, that is why Anatoly Petrovich appointed me as the First Deputy, because I had no greed to pull resources towards my own tasks. Like scarecrows all of them were hung. Valery But it also had an impressive impact once the work was complete. Why the concrete dome, which would certainly have been better, was replaced with a pipe run and a suitable metal roof. In the subordination of this Glaucus, frankly, boring, standard. They were very professional. And this wasnt because there was no such knowledge. Is there a reason for this in the storyline? He himself spent a lot of time on the site and under his leadership, the robots were created, tested and used. But additionally, any person that had been on an NPP construction site was surprised at the potential of work being done so carelessly, even on such an important project. And it turned out that this facing was radiating 800 milliroentgens per hour but here [in Chernobyl], it radiated less than 10 milliroentgens per hour. The second proposal, conversely, was to burn this entire forest down and even experiments were carried out on burning parts of this contaminated forest. So contaminated it was that he personally smashed it to pieces with a hammer. One, make the reactor maximally reliable. I fought against this project from May; an absolutely useless project. And magnesium oxide, the most heat-conducting of all ceramics, similarly carried the heat away. Well, because no one knew exactly what had happened. It was an integral device that had to be placed into the belly of the wrecked 4th block and would have provided continuous information about the temperature there, about radiation fields and some other parameters. This may have been a truly random coincidence but this is really my direct speciality. It is difficult to overestimate the work of the supply group, which was organised by the chairman of the of the Gossnab of Ukraineworking on behalf of Vitaliy Andreyevich Solov, the chairman of Gosplan of Ukrainewho, sitting in Kiev, worked miracles to ensure that all the work was carried out in Chernobyl with all the needed materials even though the amount needed was, of course, ridiculous. Punishing the direct culprits of this disaster is correct because the actions did not meet regulatory requirements and showed inconsistency with the job requirements of the people who were acting in this situation. Because of these concerns, a group of scientists from Donetsk, out of the Ministry of Energy of Ukraine, were placed under my supervision. what is the temperature? soon it was necessary to literally fight for the correct implementation of every technological mode. With the same . We became convinced that no country in the world had a proven, experimentally verified action plan for such a situation. However, this point of view of the experts was not considered. For example, the press spent a lot of time on the so-called needle which was fiddled with for a long time. "[11], While the initial Soviet investigation put almost all the blame on the operators, later findings by the IAEA found that the reactor design and how the operators were informed of safety information was more significant. Legasov: Yes, the reactivity increases by 13 times every second whereas the rod takes five or six seconds to descend. This was a difficult environment. Before the start of the meeting, Nikolai Ivanovich Yermakov, the head of the 16th head office of the Ministry of Medium Machine Building, under whose supervision our entire university was, walked up and said calmly but with some concern, that an unpleasant accident had happened at the Chernobyl Station. [1] Mikhail Gorbachev was furious and accused the nuclear designers of covering up dangerous problems with the Soviet nuclear industry for decades. And the tracking and monitoring for each one of them are very high-class. In particular, we were worried about two things: can that movement cause critical mass buildup in some region which would produce short-living isotopes. But yet, even after these measuresand all the experts in the Soviet Union knew thisfrom a control point of view, this reactor required a lot of attention from the operator and always was quite complex. He got them all from the metallurgical factories of Ukraine or somewhere else, and all of these materials were delivered. Legasov: was to prevent 2,500 degrees. It was clear that in the first few days, because of the way air masses were flowing and because of the material drops in the reactor, the contamination was spreading with the dust. More and more resources were spent on creating facilities that were not directly related to nuclear energy. Today, our measures are planned; such and such have been implemented and such and such issues worry us. It was the impression he made on us when we. 2400 tons of lead was dropped. [citation needed] Extracts from his tapes were published in Pravda in May 1988. For this temperature range, lead would be the most suitable element which would additionally act as a shield against radiation. On the second or third day, I think, I offered to organise an information group within the Government Commission. The level of fuel enrichment had to be changed, every time something Well, altogether, from the moment it was launched, there were constant changes and alterations. However, my position is somewhat distinctive. I recall, perhaps, only one statement by Professor Ivanov from Moscow Engineering-Physics Institute. Legasov: No, 14 RBMKs without containments and 14 VVERs without containments. The living accomodations, however, were placed in the city of Ivankov, which was 50 km from Chernobyl. In a few months, the Nahimov collision happened, such a severe disaster with the same carelessness and irresponsibility; then a methane explosion at a coal mine in Ukraine; a train collision in Ukraineall these within a short time. And so a generation of engineers came up who were very competent, but not critical of the devices themselves, not critical of all the systems that were ensuring their safety; but mainly knew the systems and required an increase in their numbers. Well, actively aid Anatoly Petrovich in the management of the institute, considering his occupation at the Academy of Sciencesplanning the work of the institute, the regime of its work. [7] Legasov and Anatoly Alexandrov described the meltdown scenarios, and Legasov agreed with the plan to tunnel under the reactor to provide cooling. They can be regarded as the directions work should take. Although it must be said, there were separate cases of looting or intrusions into the zone with the aim of stealing. New approaches were not welcomed. An accident is possible in which organophosphorus compounds form, a single breath of which is lethal. When I arrived there for the first time, I witnessed a grim scene because the first proper dosimetric posts were set up there. But again, a commission led by comrade Voropaev was created. The first session of the Government Commission was immediately arranged. Once a magazine called Business Week fell into my hands. There was a need for saving. People were changing clothes. It would be an organisation that would be responsible for the developmental strategy of aviation. Secondly, silt, including that in the Dnieper basin, turned out to be contaminated. This forced us to use manned helicopters, which in turn caused additional radiation exposure for the people and made these flights dangerous because the helicopters could collide with some structure and lead to the destruction of, say, a neighbouring block. But the operational staff there is considerably smaller than in our stations. He was appointed by the Soviet Government to investigate the Chernobyl disaster less than 24 hours after it occurred. This is why the first job of the first team that went in was to start the reactor shutdown procedure of the 1st and 2nd blocks. When the fire ended, when we established that the surface temperature, that was monitored, is not higher than 300 degrees Celsius, all actions targeted towards eliminating the fire itself and its spread ended. Some amount of aerosol particles were released with ascending airflows. On April 28, Legasov was supposed to disclose to the government the data of his own investigation into the causes of the Chernobyl disaster. This would perform the same task as the lead in places where it was possible to stabilise the temperature by spending excessive energy on the decay of dolomite components. It was clear that during such migrations there was no command centre prepared from which it would be possible to organise the work in such difficult conditions. They continued until somewhere between the 12th and 15th of May, with the main drops ending, as I have said, on the 2nd of May. But, well, what kind of robots? And all this was not very coherent, not orderly, and did not present to me as a unified, smooth work process. [1] After a colleague said his leadership was still needed, he said "No, you dont understand. This was a very important meeting. So, from a strictly professional perspective, I understand the safety issues, and how to manage them, very well. 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